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1. ☆ Dmitri ☭ (yogthos@mastodon.social)'s status on Saturday, 19-Feb-2022 14:16:36 UTC ☆ Dmitri ☭

   imagine the kind of reporting we'd see in western media if this happened in designated authoritarian country like China or Russia

   • Santa Claes 🇸🇪🇭🇰🎅 (clacke@libranet.de)'s status on Saturday, 19-Feb-2022 14:16:24 UTC Santa Claes 🇸🇪🇭🇰🎅

     in reply to

     • greenpete
     @yogthos It's all over the news and you're saying if this happened in e.g. Belarus it would be all over the news?
     
     @greenpete
   • ☆ Dmitri ☭ (yogthos@mastodon.social)'s status on Saturday, 19-Feb-2022 14:16:25 UTC ☆ Dmitri ☭

     in reply to

     • greenpete

     @greenpete I got the video from Reddit originally, and again this is a huge story that's all over the news. I kind of assumed that people would know the context since it's literally the main news in Canada right now.

   • greenpete@fosstodon.org's status on Saturday, 19-Feb-2022 14:16:29 UTC greenpete

     in reply to

     @yogthos Yes, I understand that.
     I still think context is important when sharing such information.
     You had the link to the video in the first place, it would have been very easy to add it to the post.
     Without the context, I am just being told something that I should believe. With context, I have a chance of understanding how, why and a lot more.

   • greenpete@fosstodon.org's status on Saturday, 19-Feb-2022 14:16:30 UTC greenpete

     in reply to

     @yogthos No, there doesn't seem there could be a justification for what's happening in the video, I agree. But If all I get from seeing the video is upset and anger, what good did sharing it do?

   • ☆ Dmitri ☭ (yogthos@mastodon.social)'s status on Saturday, 19-Feb-2022 14:16:30 UTC ☆ Dmitri ☭

     in reply to

     • greenpete

     @greenpete what you should be getting out of the video is an understanding that western freedoms stop when people start to exercise it to challenge the state.

     This is the linchpin the west uses to claim that liberal democracies are a superior form of governance.

   • ☆ Dmitri ☭ (yogthos@mastodon.social)'s status on Saturday, 19-Feb-2022 14:16:31 UTC ☆ Dmitri ☭

     in reply to

     • greenpete

     @greenpete actually, I pretty much always provide references and supporting information unless it's something that's a well documented event like this one.

     And frankly, I don't see what context could possibly justify what's happening in the video.

   • greenpete@fosstodon.org's status on Saturday, 19-Feb-2022 14:16:32 UTC greenpete

     in reply to

     @yogthos Thanks again.
     I know I could have just 'googled it' but my point is that you do a lot of 'throwing information over the wall' without supporting information. I feel this is a bad practice and want to make a point.
     I continue to to read your output because I like to be challenged and to see other points of view, but simply embedding a short video with no context I feel is akin to being provocative.

   • greenpete@fosstodon.org's status on Saturday, 19-Feb-2022 14:16:33 UTC greenpete

     in reply to

     @yogthos Thanks, can you link to where you got his information please?

   • ☆ Dmitri ☭ (yogthos@mastodon.social)'s status on Saturday, 19-Feb-2022 14:16:33 UTC ☆ Dmitri ☭

     in reply to

     • greenpete

     @greenpete I mean it's been all over the news, not like it's some obscure event that you couldn't google in two seconds https://www.newsweek.com/video-appears-show-police-horses-trampling-canadian-trucker-protesters-1680847

   • ☆ Dmitri ☭ (yogthos@mastodon.social)'s status on Saturday, 19-Feb-2022 14:16:34 UTC ☆ Dmitri ☭

     in reply to

     • greenpete

     @greenpete context is that people are protesting in Canada and the protests started affecting trade with US because the protesters blocked a bridge, and then cops started violently breaking the protest up.

   • greenpete@fosstodon.org's status on Saturday, 19-Feb-2022 14:16:35 UTC greenpete

     in reply to

     @yogthos Please give context when posting things like this. Obviously this is bad, but not stating at least the location and date is bad. Some citation would be good too.
     This seems like an attempt to just get people angry, but why?

   • Santa Claes 🇸🇪🇭🇰🎅 (clacke@libranet.de)'s status on Saturday, 19-Feb-2022 14:53:24 UTC Santa Claes 🇸🇪🇭🇰🎅

     in reply to

     • greenpete
     @yogthos Yeah, trampling protesters is always unacceptable but sadly whether the readership is expected to get upset is often colored by whether they agree with the cause.
     
     @greenpete
   • ☆ Dmitri ☭ (yogthos@mastodon.social)'s status on Saturday, 19-Feb-2022 14:53:25 UTC ☆ Dmitri ☭

     in reply to

     • Santa Claes 🇸🇪🇭🇰🎅
     • greenpete

     @clacke @greenpete Belarus is a perfect example of the point I was making in the original toot. When Belarus had protests challenging the government, western media was gushing over the protesters and demonizing the government.

     Yet, when a similar type of protest happens in a western nation then it's the protesters who are demonized.

   • Santa Claes 🇸🇪🇭🇰🎅 (clacke@libranet.de)'s status on Saturday, 19-Feb-2022 19:21:19 UTC Santa Claes 🇸🇪🇭🇰🎅

     in reply to

     • AgreeableLandscape
     @AgreeableLandscape That is a massive misrepresentation of the HK protests. There are certainly localist elements, and some of them show xenophobia toward mainlanders, but mainlanders were involved as well. The core driving issue since 2014 was just for Beijing to uphold their end of the bargain and maintain the region's autonomy.
     
     This was all going in the right direction until Xi took over the mainland and Leung took over HK. They and Lam are what made the city lose confidence in the administration.
     
     @yogthos
   • AgreeableLandscape (agreeablelandscape@mastodon.social)'s status on Saturday, 19-Feb-2022 19:21:20 UTC AgreeableLandscape

     in reply to

     @yogthos to be fair, the protest was a fascist shitshow from day one.

     Then again, the Hong Kong protests were also fascist and got WAY worse, and the police over there still used basically no violence.

   • Santa Claes 🇸🇪🇭🇰🎅 (clacke@libranet.de)'s status on Saturday, 19-Feb-2022 19:23:24 UTC Santa Claes 🇸🇪🇭🇰🎅

     in reply to

     • AgreeableLandscape
     The main complaint by anarchists toward the protests has not been that it would be fascist, but rather that it was too liberal.
     
     @yogthos @AgreeableLandscape
   • Santa Claes 🇸🇪🇭🇰🎅 (clacke@libranet.de)'s status on Saturday, 19-Feb-2022 20:20:49 UTC Santa Claes 🇸🇪🇭🇰🎅

     in reply to

     • AgreeableLandscape
     @AgreeableLandscape This video is rife with issues. Here's what I agree with:
     
     - Hongkongers overall are massively racist and they're xenophobic and prejudiced against mainlanders.
     - Police are still showing more restraint than e.g. US, UK, French, Spanish and Italian police.
     - The ELAB would on the surface seem like nothing more than greater flexibility in providing actual justice.
     - Millennials and zoomers may see colonial times with rose-tinted glasses as they didn't experience them.
     - Protesters wrote slogans in English and waved US and colonial flags to get international attention.
     
     @yogthos
   • AgreeableLandscape (agreeablelandscape@mastodon.social)'s status on Saturday, 19-Feb-2022 20:20:51 UTC AgreeableLandscape

     in reply to

     • Santa Claes 🇸🇪🇭🇰🎅

     @clacke @yogthos so why were the Hong Kong protests triggered by an extradition bill written by the Hong Kong autonomous government, which would give said government more flexibility to extradite criminals to other countries without locking them into an extradition treaty first? Sounds like something that would give them even more autonomy.

     This video has some issues, but its analysis of the Hong Kong situation is good. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=b-nl0Hklwvg

   • Santa Claes 🇸🇪🇭🇰🎅 (clacke@libranet.de)'s status on Thursday, 24-Feb-2022 21:02:59 UTC Santa Claes 🇸🇪🇭🇰🎅

     in reply to

     • AgreeableLandscape
     @yogthos Beijing allowed local government to handle it, as they were supposed to, but as local government consists of career bureaucrats appointed by Beijing, they are totally incompetent at understanding Hong Kong people. Carrie Lam genuinely didn't understand how the ELAB would look, how people would respond to it being rushed through LegCo and why people took to the street, so political dialogue was impossible.
     
     She thought she was trying to reason with protesters but in the end just called them spoiled teenagers for not seeing Beijing's point of view on something that was supposedly a local matter.
     
     @AgreeableLandscape
   • ☆ Dmitri ☭ (yogthos@mastodon.social)'s status on Thursday, 24-Feb-2022 21:03:00 UTC ☆ Dmitri ☭

     in reply to

     • AgreeableLandscape

     @AgreeableLandscape yeah, I think it's interesting to consider how China allowed HK protests to go on for over a year until national security law was enacted. Meanwhile, Canada cracked down as soon as the bridge to US got blocked.

     Really shows what country respects people's right to protest more.