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1. 御園はくい (hakui@freezepeach.xyz)'s status on Saturday, 27-May-2017 02:13:44 UTC 御園はくい

   • yatagarasu
   @yata it helps if you just send a whole lot of applications everywhere because you get less attached to each one and stop going "what if i'm wasting their time? will they blacklist me" etc
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   • Dad (noyoushutthefuckupdad@shitposter.club)'s status on Saturday, 27-May-2017 02:40:37 UTC Dad

     • 無
     • yatagarasu
     @eris @hakui @yata I was raised by boomers who were good-hearted but coddled me too much and didn't expect me to do jack shit with myself so I didn't feel like an adult until age 25 or so. I've been seriously impressed by the young people on GS. Generation Z is going to save civilization.
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   • Dad (noyoushutthefuckupdad@shitposter.club)'s status on Saturday, 27-May-2017 02:51:58 UTC Dad

     • Dr. Edward Morbius Yig
     @morbius Born 1983, so one of the first millennials, I think. Life before the internet was a completely different planet than what we have now; it was like watching a sci-fi movie where new technology drastically changes culture.
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   • Hallå Kitteh (clacke@social.heldscal.la)'s status on Saturday, 27-May-2017 03:25:45 UTC Hallå Kitteh

     • Dad
     @noyoushutthefuckupdad I'm sure the feeling was mutual.
   • Hallå Kitteh (clacke@social.heldscal.la)'s status on Saturday, 27-May-2017 03:32:23 UTC Hallå Kitteh

     in reply to

     • Dad
     @noyoushutthefuckupdad Sure was. I went to my elder brother's friend to play with his C64, and there was a PC in the library.
   • Hallå Kitteh (clacke@social.heldscal.la)'s status on Sunday, 28-May-2017 01:56:23 UTC Hallå Kitteh

     • Dad
     • Solderpunk
     @solderpunk @noyoushutthefuckupdad The generation that played with C64s and maybe those who played with Amigas and still assembled their PCs themselves, are the last generation that understands computers.
   • Herr Ginsterbusch (ginsterbusch@kosmos.social)'s status on Sunday, 28-May-2017 12:59:42 UTC Herr Ginsterbusch

     in reply to

     • Dad
     • Hallå Kitteh
     • Solderpunk

     @solderpunk @noyoushutthefuckupdad @clacke we'll see about that , wont we? my "brand spanking new" son is starting into programming soon (web design / app game programming), tought by a generation c128d guy (ie. me) .. lets see how much He's gonna grok ;)

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   • Hallå Kitteh (clacke@social.heldscal.la)'s status on Sunday, 28-May-2017 23:03:26 UTC Hallå Kitteh

     in reply to

     • Dad
     • Solderpunk
     • Herr Ginsterbusch
     @ginsterbusch @noyoushutthefuckupdad @solderpunk Yeah, I'm gonna see if I can help mine break the pattern too. Maybe Arduinos and Raspberries are today's C64s and C128Ds.
   • Solderpunk (solderpunk@gnusocial.no)'s status on Monday, 29-May-2017 00:40:29 UTC Solderpunk

     in reply to

     • Dad
     • Hallå Kitteh
     • Herr Ginsterbusch
     @ginsterbusch @noyoushutthefuckupdad The RPi foundation explicitly make reference to the BBC Micro in their literature about the educational potential of the Pi, but frankly, I don't see the similarity. At the end of the day the Pi is a 64-bit ARM machine running a multi-user Unix operating system with a hundred layers of complex abstraction between you and the bare metal. It doesn't smack you in the face with its Turing machine nature like the old machines did.
     
     But, hey, I would absolutely love to be proven wrong and see a new generation of hackers flourish.
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   • Hallå Kitteh (clacke@social.heldscal.la)'s status on Monday, 29-May-2017 01:01:10 UTC Hallå Kitteh

     • Dad
     • Solderpunk
     • Herr Ginsterbusch
     @solderpunk @noyoushutthefuckupdad @ginsterbusch
     
     They run a full, hyper-abstract OS on a hardware that includes hyper-abstract signal interfaces, that's true. So it doesn't help you understand computers the same way fighting config.sys and setting the I/O ports of the spanking new SB you installed in the ISA slot.
     
     But it's also what you do with it. If you type a few lines of JS/Lua/C/Forth/Lisp/D/OCaml/Haskell to flip the state of some LEDs that you soldered onto somewhere that's still so much more educational than anything you do on your tablet or laptop. And that's what you are likely to do if you're playing with the Arduino in particular, but possibly also with the Pi.
   • Hallå Kitteh (clacke@social.heldscal.la)'s status on Monday, 29-May-2017 01:09:05 UTC Hallå Kitteh

     • Dad
     • Solderpunk
     • Herr Ginsterbusch
     @noyoushutthefuckupdad @solderpunk @ginsterbusch The Pi doesn't force you to plug electronic components together, but it encourages and allows for it.
   • Hallå Kitteh (clacke@social.heldscal.la)'s status on Monday, 29-May-2017 02:13:00 UTC Hallå Kitteh

     • Annah
     • Dad
     • Solderpunk
     • Herr Ginsterbusch
     @maiyannah @noyoushutthefuckupdad @solderpunk @ginsterbusch Everything hides something. Anything that hides less than our tablets is a step forward. If you have fiddled I/O ports in Lua you already know more about hardware than the 1% of the 1% of people who use computers, and you might even know more than someone who played with some assembly lines in the C128 machine code monitor.
   • Hallå Kitteh (clacke@social.heldscal.la)'s status on Monday, 29-May-2017 02:37:23 UTC Hallå Kitteh

     • Annah
     @maiyannah You are showing your embedded programmer bias. ;-)
     
     I'm not talking about rote programming, I'm talking about just getting kids to solder things and fiddle bits. Everything else follows from there. They will be writing assembly and C in the end, it's just not realistic to start from there.
     
     In the 80s that was all we had, there was nothing to compete with, so that was fine. In 1976, people were content with flipping switches to do programming. There are like five people in the world today who would buy an Altair 8800 to learn how a computer works.
   • Hallå Kitteh (clacke@social.heldscal.la)'s status on Monday, 29-May-2017 03:01:50 UTC Hallå Kitteh

     • Annah
     @maiyannah I'm not making value judgements, I'm just talking about the incentives and the market of fun things to do. To engage people you need to give them something that can give them satisfaction.
   • Hallå Kitteh (clacke@social.heldscal.la)'s status on Monday, 29-May-2017 03:02:12 UTC Hallå Kitteh

     • Annah
     • Dad
     • Solderpunk
     • Herr Ginsterbusch
     @ginsterbusch @maiyannah @noyoushutthefuckupdad @solderpunk
     
     Genau.
   • Hallå Kitteh (clacke@social.heldscal.la)'s status on Monday, 29-May-2017 03:04:44 UTC Hallå Kitteh

     in reply to

     • Annah
     • Hallå Kitteh
     @maiyannah When we were kids we could play with sticks in the forest, we could do sports, we could read comics, or we could enter DATA lines from a magazine for an hour. Kids these days have WoW and probably cooler things I haven't heard about.
   • Hallå Kitteh (clacke@social.heldscal.la)'s status on Monday, 29-May-2017 03:05:59 UTC Hallå Kitteh

     • Annah
     • dawnbreez
     @dbrz @maiyannah Yes. We can teach programming without starting with the nitty-gritty details that in the end are very important, but really incidental to the concepts of stringing operations together.
   • Hallå Kitteh (clacke@social.heldscal.la)'s status on Monday, 29-May-2017 03:07:11 UTC Hallå Kitteh

     • Herr Ginsterbusch
     @ginsterbusch What if it turns out he's you, using cam-drones?
     
     *theremin plays*
   • Hallå Kitteh (clacke@social.heldscal.la)'s status on Monday, 29-May-2017 06:03:41 UTC Hallå Kitteh

     in reply to

     • Hallå Kitteh
     - The stalker was within you the whole time.
     
     - What if the true stalkers are the friends we made along the way?
   • Ed S (eds@mastodon.sdf.org)'s status on Monday, 29-May-2017 14:31:42 UTC Ed S

     in reply to

     • Dad
     • Hallå Kitteh
     • Solderpunk
     • Herr Ginsterbusch

     About that #raspberrypi @solderpunk - I do see a connection with the #BBCmicro - it's a hands-on and very personal machine. Swap SD cards and you've swapped projects - no wrestling with applications co-existing. And it's not (just) a linux machine - can program at bare metal, can run RISC OS, even booting rapidly to a Basic prompt. And it has I/O. We can wait and see - but I'm optimistic!
     @ginsterbusch @clacke @noyoushutthefuckupdad

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   • Ed S (eds@mastodon.sdf.org)'s status on Tuesday, 30-May-2017 09:47:46 UTC Ed S

     • Dad
     • Hallå Kitteh
     • Solderpunk
     • Herr Ginsterbusch

     @solderpunk The UK #raspberrypi in education guide suggests(?) four stages: first scratch, then python and pygame, then networked applications and GPIOs, and then the linux command line. I'm sure each teacher or school has its own approach. I like the idea of eventually teaching everything - see #nand2tetris - but it makes sense to teach in stages, and at stage real-world motivation.

     @ginsterbusch @clacke @noyoushutthefuckupdad

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