@switchingsocial @DashEquals Nothing here still justifies blocking instances who don't block Gab.

That's just silly and shooting the #Fediverse in the foot. You're not protecting your own instance at all, you're just breaking federation with people who are not a part of the target block.

@DashEquals @jaywink

Simply allowing Nazis into debates normalises them, makes them a respectable alternative. People who would never have considered them suddenly start to listen to what they have to say.

Allowing neo-Nazis airtime gives them victory.

The concept of the "marketplace of ideas" is misplaced in this case, because there is no consistent idea to be debated in Nazism, only an abstract hatred of "the other."

@DashEquals @jaywink

Nazis aren't interested in debate, they are interested in dogwhistling the most awful bigotry.

The most politically successful far right candidates of recent years aren't particularly skilful rhetorically or intellectually.

That's because Nazis don't see debates as debates, they see them as an advertising opportunities. All they have to do is say to potential voters: "we're on your side, we hate the foreigners too", and the debate becomes an irrelevant sideshow.

@switchingsocial @jaywink I respectfully disagree, it's not black and white.

Some instances, for example, might be for political debate. Blocking Gab there wouldn't make sense.

Another might have the goal of deconverting neo-Nazis. Members there would want to federate with Gab to convince them why they're wrong/

Also, an instance that isn't either of those could silence Gab, preventing them from recruiting, but still allowing their users to interact.

@DashEquals @jaywink

From a technical point of view, there is no neutral position when discussing federation.

This is a rare case of a genuinely binary choice: an instance either allows federation with neo-Nazis like Gab, or it doesn't.

If an instance allows federation with neo-Nazis, it is increasing the real life risk to vulnerable groups, because such federation makes it easier for neo-Nazis to recruit people to their cause.

It is reasonable to defederate with such instances.

@jaywink Yeah, blocking Gab is of course reasonable, but the line of "you're with us or against us" will harm what we're trying to build here.

@DashEquals

> "or example, many instances are blocking https://mstdn.io because they refuse to block Gab"

Wow the amount of silly this is is confusing.

#mastodon #gab

People's reactions to Gab joining the Fediverse has done, and will continue to do, far more damage to the communities here than Gab itself.

For example, many instances are blocking https://mstdn.io because they refuse to block Gab, separating people from their possible and actual friends on the network. This is harmful.

Defederating based off of who other instances federate with will harm adoption. When a user can't follow their friends on most nodes, they'll lose interest quickly.

Hanging out today on #SDF for the 32nd year anniversary! #SDF32 https://wm.sdf.org/gallery/displayimage.php?album=899&pid=18520#top_display_media

definitely recommend playing with microsoft word on UNIXv on @SDF 's 3B2 ( ssh -l sdf tty.livingcomputers.org ) #retrotech #living #sdf32

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